Smoking Around Apple Computers May Void Warranty

Rob Williams

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From our front-page news:
As tech enthusiasts, if a problem arises with our PCs, notebooks, or whatever other gadgets we might be using, it's automatic to attempt a fix ourselves before going through the dreaded process of getting someone else to. After all, who on this earth would enjoy calling up tech support to talk to someone who has less tech knowledge than they do? Even worse is to try to convince someone over the phone that your PC or product does need repaired, and that it's not just a "user error".

But, it's inevitable that from time to time, something will break that you can't fix, so the only option is to get an official dealer to take a look at it. Though it's an inconvenience, it's better than nothing... unless you're a smoker. As it turns out, Apple considers smoking to potentially degrade your desktop, mobile or whatever else, and as a result, it's been refusing service on products where smoking around the product is evident. It doesn't matter if you have the best Apple care plan available... Apple can refuse to even touch the thing.

I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with me here (probably all smokers), but I'm having a hard time disagreeing with Apple's policies here. I don't believe that an authoritative study has been done to find out the effects that chemicals from smoking can have on electronics, but knowing what they can do to a human body, I have little doubt that there's potential for degradation of components over time.

That's not entirely the reason Apple is refusing smoke-ridden machines, though. It comes down to the fact that it's unhealthy to handle PCs that have been smoked around for a long period of time, and the company considers it a hazard to its employees. Again, I can't disagree there. I've seen a lot of computers that reside in houses where one or more people smoke, and they're truly disgusting. I don't believe that simply handling a smoke-caked computer is going to cause near as much damage as second-hand smoke would, but it's disgusting nonetheless. The same could be said about PCs where food is dropped in between the keys, though, so it's tough to decide what's "too disgusting".

What do you guys think about this? Is Apple in the right here, or the wrong? Should other companies follow suit? Or is it truly unacceptable and a huge insult to those who smoke? It should be mentioned that nowhere in Apple's warranty policy does it mention that smoking can void the warranty, and I have a good feeling it wouldn't, because the idea is a little foolish. It would essentially mean that no one could smoke in their own house, and that's going to sound a little extreme to a lot of people. But on the other hand, if there's a good reason for refusing smoke-caked computers, then it might be an accepted policy.

apple_macbook_pro_snow_leopard_060909.jpg

Coming to the i5 family of products, these processors support Hyper-Threading and you should see four threads in Task Manager. Depending on a model, Turbo will accelerate one core between 3.46 and 3.73 GHz, with the only odd model being i5-661. 661 carries almost identical specs if it wasn't for the clock - integrated graphics works at 900 MHz and we would expect Intel to push this unit hard, proving that 900MHz clock is sufficient for acceptable 3D performance.


Source: The Consumerist
 

MacMan

Partition Master
Over Reaction!

It's an over reaction on Apple's part as far as I'm concerned. Sure, smoking is bad for your health, including the health of your electronic gear, but seriously, this is ridiculous, and if it was my computer I would sue since nothing in the warranty contract lists smoking as a cause for denial of service..

Since Apple has the largest piggy bank in the tech world, some 34 - 37 billion bucks, I'm sure that Apple could easily afford to buy their technicians some masks and rubber gloves, couldn't they? I can understand if there was two inches of tar covering the inners and outers of the gear, but no one in the world smokes that much, or do they?.

In the end, not too many people have complained with this problem, because thankfully, for most of us these days, we simply don't smoke any more! Smoking is a dying habit in more ways than one, apparently.
 

Rob Williams

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Doomsday: PLEASE don't quote the entire news post when quoting. Just paraphrase. As for the wrong paragraph, that was just one of my usual mistakes. Thanks for pointing it out... it's been fixed.

MacMan: Geez, I never expected to be in a position where I agreed with something Apple did and you didn't ;) I agree with your logic though, and it's true. If mom and pop shops can repair PCs of people who smoke, then Apple can surely do something to make it possible. It still stands, though, that smoking makes computers disgusting. Fortunately, so many PC chassis' today are not beige. Back when they were, smoke damage was <em>really</em> noticeable.
 

Tharic-Nar

Senior Editor
Staff member
Moderator
In some way, i'm surprised they didn't do this sooner, or indeed other manufacturers. While the warranty may not explicitly state that smoke will void the warranty, there is more than likely a clause that says something to the effect of, 'we can not be held responsible for any damage caused as a result of foreign material...'. They would argue that Smoke is a foreign material, and i guess dust is as well, it's just smoke is a hell of a lot harder to clean (after trying to clean it myself).

Most manufacturers have a clause like the above somewhere, it's like trying to claim a repair under warranty for a washing machine that's jammed due to a coin getting stuck in the drum, most will not cover it because a coin is not part of the machines internals and deemed a 'foreign material/object'.

Still, i would be more than annoyed if later on, i was told that my warranty doesn't cover dust... (the manufacturer should have foreseen this and installed air filters...)
 

Psi*

Tech Monkey
GO APPLE! I had fits at people that used to eat much less smoke (in the day) around even my Trash 80! (aka TRS 80 by Radio Shack). They laughed at me then too. :(
 

b1lk1

Tech Monkey
I hate nothing more than working on a PC that belongs to a smoker. They stink like second hand smoke and they are generally dirtier inside. This is one Apple policy I can agree with.
 

MacMan

Partition Master
GO APPLE! I had fits at people that used to eat much less smoke (in the day) around even my Trash 80! (aka TRS 80 by Radio Shack). They laughed at me then too. :(

Even though, at the time, I used to trash the TRS - 80, looking back at it now, after these many, many years, I have grown to deeply respect this pioneering computer, and I have many found memories of using one. I never owned one myself, but , I had friends who did, and thus I will always have a soft spot for this machine, as I wrote on my own little practice blog.

Ah, the good old days!


http://my2cents4theday.blogspot.com/2008/01/blast-from-past-trs-80.html
 

Rob Williams

Editor-in-Chief
Staff member
Moderator
Tharic-Nar said:
While the warranty may not explicitly state that smoke will void the warranty, there is more than likely a clause that says something to the effect of, 'we can not be held responsible for any damage caused as a result of foreign material...'.

First off, welcome to the forums :)

I was thinking of the same thing, and knowing Apple and its legion of lawyers, I'm sure that's the case. But you're also right about the "dust" example... I think we can all agree that smoke could damage a computer, but where does it end? Could Apple or others refuse computers owned by those with bad breath, or wear cashmere sweaters? Alright, I'm exaggerating just a bit, but it is interesting to think about.

GO APPLE! I had fits at people that used to eat much less smoke (in the day) around even my Trash 80! (aka TRS 80 by Radio Shack). They laughed at me then too.

Yes... that's one of the reasons I hate smoking. It's not that it affects those who smoke, but -others- as well. Back when the clubs in Canada allowed smoking, I used to come home at the end of the night and people thought I was the one smoking, because it was just so strong. If you can get that kind of effect after just a couple of hours, imagine weeks, months, or years...

b1lk1 said:
I hate nothing more than working on a PC that belongs to a smoker. They stink like second hand smoke and they are generally dirtier inside. This is one Apple policy I can agree with.

I tend to agree there also, and I shudder to think of fixing such a PC again...

Ah, the good old days!

That's a great blog post! I admit that though I've heard of the TRS-80, I didn't know too much about it, but that post enlightened me to what a cool computer it was. I kicked my computing off with a Commodore 64, but even then, I don't think I used it until years after released (C64 came out in '82, I was born in '83, so I hope I wasn't on a PC quite so early... though it would explain a lot today)
 

Tharic-Nar

Senior Editor
Staff member
Moderator
First off, welcome to the forums :)

I was thinking of the same thing, and knowing Apple and its legion of lawyers, I'm sure that's the case. But you're also right about the "dust" example... I think we can all agree that smoke could damage a computer, but where does it end? Could Apple or others refuse computers owned by those with bad breath, or wear cashmere sweaters? Alright, I'm exaggerating just a bit, but it is interesting to think about.

Thank you, i've actually been one of those evil RSS lurkers, been reading up here for.... urm.... quite a while.

Pet Hair, insects, spider webs, hell, i've had a Bee caught in-between my main heatsink and fan (side panel was off for ventilation during the summer), think if someone with an allergy had to pick that out, or indeed, what about nut allergies as well.

Manufacturers tend to expect owners to 'look after' their purchased equipment, usually they prefer a trained professional, but in order to perform said maintenance, users will inevitably scratch/tear the warranty stickers, so it becomes a catch 22. Clean equipment out, but void the warranty, or leave it to suffocate under an inch of dust - and void the warranty. They could easily claim excessive dust as 'negligence'... not trying to give them any ideas....

If memory serves, there was a case with the Eee PC when it was first released, in order to upgrade the memory or hard drive, a warranty sticker had to be removed. Supposedly it was a deterrent to stop average Joe from doing the upgrade, even though the warranty would not be void by performing the upgrade. Also, there was case with a PSU on a desktop, the warranty sticker was on the side of the PSU and would scrape off when installing the unit because cases tend to have sharp edges and support bars for the PSU.

My Guess is, this won't be the last we here of something like this, they'll tighten down on the small print, or more accurately, broaden it to be as generic as possible. Other companies will probably follow suit as well, unless they already do so.
 

Rob Williams

Editor-in-Chief
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Tharic-Nar said:
Thank you, i've actually been one of those evil RSS lurkers, been reading up here for.... urm.... quite a while.

Nah, not evil, just without some great tech conversation! ;-)

Tharic-Nar said:
i've had a Bee caught in-between my main heatsink and fan (side panel was off for ventilation during the summer)

Ugh, that sounds like quite the situation. Was the bee still alive when it was taken out, or? I'm curious... did you see this happen, or did you just happen to notice the PC was off or something like that, and then discovered it?

Tharic-Nar said:
They could easily claim excessive dust as 'negligence'... not trying to give them any ideas....

That's true, but I think that'd have to be a lot of dust. I don't think it's against any warranty (that I'm aware of) to take off the side panel and use compressed air to remove the dust. Dust is a horrible killer of PC components, so I cannot understand a company who'd void a warranty from just that. It's common-sense that dust needs to be pushed out of the computer.

The same goes for notebooks, although rarely will you actually need to crack it open (in that case, I could understand the voided warranty, because it's not simple to pull off). I had a Dell notebook a few years ago, and after it finally died after four years, I opened it up, and couldn't believe the lack of dust in there. As long as you use some compressed air on the exhausts from time to time, you should be fine.

Tharic-Nar said:
If memory serves, there was a case with the Eee PC when it was first released, in order to upgrade the memory or hard drive, a warranty sticker had to be removed. Supposedly it was a deterrent to stop average Joe from doing the upgrade, even though the warranty would not be void by performing the upgrade.

I remember that, although I'm not sure I heard whether or not that was done on purpose or not.

You're right though, this isn't going to be the last we've heard of something like this. If this anti-smoking thing with Apple is true, then we should be hearing about it a lot more going forward. An insane number of people smoke, so it's an issue that wouldn't be kept quiet.
 

Tharic-Nar

Senior Editor
Staff member
Moderator
Ugh, that sounds like quite the situation. Was the bee still alive when it was taken out, or? I'm curious... did you see this happen, or did you just happen to notice the PC was off or something like that, and then discovered it?
There was a Bee flying around, and becoming quite annoying. I got out of my chair, the Bee flew down near to my computer, i glanced over and it started off towards the window. I went out, got a drink, came back in, Bee was gone, so i assumed it went out the window. Few months later, CPU temps are running a little high, so i decide to do some spring (autumn) cleaning on my computer. Took the fan off the heatsink to get at the dust, and low and behold, a Bee stuck between the fan support bracket and the heatsink... as well as countless mosquito's. Needless to say, it was dead.

For the techy inclined, the Heatsink in question was a thermaltake copper CL-P0024, to which i would link to the thermaltake page, but it's coming up as a japanese 404, so newegg will have to do...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835106044

Had 2 thermaltake Streetfighters on it, the 80mmx35mm fans that rev at 6000 rpm in a push/pull fashion (to which again, thermaltake do not list on their website.... ah, the good old days of Netburst, 11Ghz hyperthreaded Pentium 4's... :p ). They're not quite Delta's, but they can definitely cause long term ear damage. I didn't notice the Bee flying around for quite a while, since i couldn't hear it, nor did i hear any slowdown when said bee flew into the spinning blades of its impending doom. And yes, the Bee was in one piece when i pulled it out, since the Streefighter has a 3 blade design with large gaps in-between... to which the fan was powered by a thermaltake butterfly PSU (no irony there...) inside a thermaltake Xaser III case.... and thats enough thermltake promotion for today..... This was a fair few years back when i was naive :p.

That's true, but I think that'd have to be a lot of dust. I don't think it's against any warranty (that I'm aware of) to take off the side panel and use compressed air to remove the dust. Dust is a horrible killer of PC components, so I cannot understand a company who'd void a warranty from just that. It's common-sense that dust needs to be pushed out of the computer.
True, but since when were warranties catered to Consumer needs and Common-sense...
 

Rob Williams

Editor-in-Chief
Staff member
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Tharic-Nar said:
Took the fan off the heatsink to get at the dust, and low and behold, a Bee stuck between the fan support bracket and the heatsink... as well as countless mosquito's.

Heh, gotta love summer! That's still rather insane though... I wouldn't imagine that a bee, or any insect would go towards something like a fan, or something that made noise. I almost wonder if it was an instance where they couldn't resist, or they tried to escape and couldn't. What a strange way to go, though, haha.

Tharic-Nar said:
For the techy inclined, the Heatsink in question was a thermaltake copper CL-P0024, to which i would link to the thermaltake page, but it's coming up as a japanese 404

Not to nit-pick, but that's Chinese. Japanese writing is "simpler" in its most common usage, as less strokes are required to create an expression, and downward curved strokes are used quite often. Chinese on the other hand is a bit blockier, with lots of strokes being used for each expression. Simple characters aren't used all too often inside of a regular sentence, unless it's a number or simple word required to have the expression make sense.

Tharic-Nar said:
Had 2 thermaltake Streetfighters on it, the 80mmx35mm fans that rev at 6000 rpm in a push/pull fashion (to which again, thermaltake do not list on their website.... ah, the good old days of Netburst, 11Ghz hyperthreaded Pentium 4's... )

Ahh yes, the era of computing when no one had to touch their thermostats in the winter, but still saw their power bill go up anyway. Seriously though, 6000 RPM going all the time? No wonder you were concerned about vibration, wow. I have a couple of Tornados that I turn on from time to time for a laugh, but I never thought to actually install the beasts, haha.

Tharic-Nar said:
True, but since when were warranties catered to Consumer needs and Common-sense...

Yeah, what was I thinking? :-/
 

Kougar

Techgage Staff
Staff member
Well, not much Apple can do if the employee refuses to work on the machine because it's an OSHA violation. OSHA was implemented to protect employees and give them rights, after all.

If the machine has enough tar/crud built up in it that an employee can easily tell it belonged to a smoker, then it's going to be nasty to work on. I'm sure machines that a user can't tell they were smoked around (beyond the smell) would be worked on in most cases.

Some smoker's clothes reek like walking, stale ashtrays, and the smell is strong even 20 feet in their wake. If their clothes smell that bad yet get washed regularly, I'm sure there are plenty of super-nasty computers/laptops out there I'd refuse to work on too. ;)

That's not even considering what the smoke will do to the internals of a fan housing, it will cause the fans to gunk and wear out much more quickly than they should have otherwise...
 
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Rob Williams

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Well, not much Apple can do if the employee refuses to work on the machine because it's an OSHA violation. OSHA was implemented to protect employees and give them rights, after all.

If that's true, then that settles it right there. But, if a PC is sent into Apple, someone has to work on it, else Apple would have to deal with some legalities I'm sure.
 
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