Choice to upgrade...

[dborgill]

To make a long story short, I have a 3200+ Venice 939 with 2 gigs of Corsair Value RAM. The highest I can overclock to is 2.4 Ghz with about 39c full load.

I have a chance to upgrade either my RAM or my CPU.

Here are my choices:

1 - Upgrade to better RAM to push my 3200+ to it's max

2 - Upgrade my CPU to a 3700+ for a higher multiplier and 1 meg cache

3 - Upgrade my CPU to an Opteron 148 939 for supposedly great overclocks

Any suggestions?

[madmat]

I'd say go with the Opty, you can always use a divider on your ram to prevent it going out of spec so that won't be a hold up.

Later get some faster "Enthusiast" grade ram but try to stick with a 2x1gig kit for the best performance.

[dborgill]

I'd say go with the Opty, you can always use a divider on your ram to prevent it going out of spec so that won't be a hold up.

Later get some faster "Enthusiast" grade ram but try to stick with a 2x1gig kit for the best performance.


Thanks!

I've heard that the Opty runs hotter but I am only at 37 C on full load as it is.. I dunno.

I gotta decide today.. :confused:

[madmat]

What cooling setup are you using? You might consider getting a Thermaltake Big Typhoon which is a really effective cooling unit.

[dborgill]

What cooling setup are you using? You might consider getting a Thermaltake Big Typhoon which is a really effective cooling unit.

I have a Thermaltake Venus and have been VERY happy with it. Overclocked from 2.0 to 2.4 I am 28 C Idle and 39 C full load.

[Jakal]

Just my input. Go with the Opty. I've got a Opty 150 running at 2.7Ghz with Patriot ram. I haven't even messed with the core voltages. I'll be getting some Pc4000 ram to see how high I can boost it. I'm using a Zalman 9500 and the motherboard fan controller. I haven't seen the temps peak above 30c. A good water cooling system would help push it even further.

[dborgill]

Just my input. Go with the Opty. I've got a Opty 150 running at 2.7Ghz with Patriot ram. I haven't even messed with the core voltages. I'll be getting some Pc4000 ram to see how high I can boost it. I'm using a Zalman 9500 and the motherboard fan controller. I haven't seen the temps peak above 30c. A good water cooling system would help push it even further.


Cool -- I am going with the Opty and my friend will take my RAM as trade in. Any suggestions on going with DDR466 or DDR500? Is there any difference between 4 x 512 of the 466 or 2 x 1 gig of the 500?

[madmat]

Go with the 2x1 gig kit, with 4x512 you'll be forced to run 2T command rate and that's a big performance hit. With a 2x1 gig kit you'll keep your 1T command rate so your overall memory bandwidth will be higher even at looser cas timings.

[Rob Williams]

What Matt said, and welcome to the forums :)

[dborgill]

What Matt said, and welcome to the forums :)


Awesome. I am going with the 2x1 gig kit...

Is 2.5 or 2 CAS a must or would 2x1 gig DDR500 3 cas still overclock ok?

[Rob Williams]

CAS 2 is the best really. CAS 3 is *ok*, but you will want to make sure that specific module will OC well. In the end, you want to make sure you have at least CAS 2.5, because you want the fastest possible response in new games.

[dborgill]

CAS 2 is the best really. CAS 3 is *ok*, but you will want to make sure that specific module will OC well. In the end, you want to make sure you have at least CAS 2.5, because you want the fastest possible response in new games.


Hmmm.... 4x512 DDR433 CAS2 or 2x1 gig DDR500 CAS3

:confused:

EDIT: The problem is my computer store owner friend only has limited supplies so I don't have much choice.

[Rob Williams]

2*1GB for sure. Just pump enough voltage so that it can handle CAS2, hehe. What set are you looking at?

[dborgill]

2*1GB for sure. Just pump enough voltage so that it can handle CAS2, hehe. What set are you looking at?


Ummm... I don't dare to speak the blasphemy...

But in my price range, the only ones I can get are the Super Talent with heat spreaders.

[Rob Williams]

Super Talent currently only uses Infineon Rev B chips, so you will not likely get much overclocking out of those to be honest. I am not sure what your price range is, but here's my favorite 2GB kit currently:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145596

These should also prove worthy:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820231021

[dborgill]

Crap... I wish my supplier had more choices.

I really think the G-skill would be best for the budget and I have read good things about then... I just don't think he can order from anyone besides Ma Labs..

[Rob Williams]

What's wrong with ordering from a place like NewEgg? Having your choices cut down like that is not a good thing :P

The ST will probably suit you fine, but like I said, they will not be great for overclocking.

[dborgill]

What's wrong with ordering from a place like NewEgg? Having your choices cut down like that is not a good thing :P

The ST will probably suit you fine, but like I said, they will not be great for overclocking.

Oh, I love Newegg. It's just my supplier takes my used hardware in for credit and he has a credit account with MA Labs. He gets like 14 day credit with MA Labs.

He is kinda falling on hard times and so am I LOL!

EDIT: I wonder if the Super Talent 2x1 gig would be better or worse than my current Corsair Value 4x512...

[Rob Williams]

You currently HAVE 4*512? It may not be a huge upgrade, unless the Super Talent you want is DDR500. Either way, if you are only using 1GB right now, you can't go wrong with 2GB of any brand, really.

[dborgill]

You currently HAVE 4*512? It may not be a huge upgrade, unless the Super Talent you want is DDR500. Either way, if you are only using 1GB right now, you can't go wrong with 2GB of any brand, really.

Right now = 4*512 Corsair ValuMem DDR400 (2 gig total) - 3200+ Venice @ 2.4
Only thing I can order = 2*1 gig SuperTalent DDR500 (2 gig total) - Opteron 148

EDIT: The only other semi decent stuff MA Labs has it Kingston HyperX but they only have 512 meg chips and they are expensive

I am just trying to decide what to do...

[Rob Williams]

Yeah I don't recommend Kingston. Yeah, can't really go wrong with the Super Talent and Optie. That will give you 2.5GHz cpu at 1:1 right off the bat. You shouldn't really have too much of a problem with that setup. You can always post in the forums here for advice in overclocking both :)

[dborgill]

Yeah I don't recommend Kingston. Yeah, can't really go wrong with the Super Talent and Optie. That will give you 2.5GHz cpu at 1:1 right off the bat. You shouldn't really have too much of a problem with that setup. You can always post in the forums here for advice in overclocking both :)

You guys have been EXTREMELY friendly and helpful. I will post my results when I receive them this weekend! SEE YOU THEN! :cool:

[Rob Williams]

Glad to help man! I anticipate your results :D

[dborgill]

Ok, I got my stuff and here are my stable results running 1:1

Any suggestions to get higher?

http://img152.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cpu8uc.jpg

EDIT: It's nice though that on these settings I can run Everquest II pretty smooth at 1600x1200 extreme quality settings! Gotta keep pushing it though...

[Rob Williams]

That's not even default speeds, hehe. What are your VDIMM settings at? Are you able to download SANDRA and run the memory bandwidth benchmark and send just post your results? Also, what are your memory timings?

[madmat]

I thought you were going with the Opty...

[dborgill]

Ok, sorry I didn't give the full info on my last post. My supplier couldn't get the Opty so I had to go with the 3700+. I loosened up my mem timings and now I am running this stable. Here is my CPU and memory info:

CPU

http://img82.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cpu25xx.jpg

MEM

http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/2168/mem6mq.jpg

Any other questions?

EDIT - I don't have SANDRA but I have Everest and here are the memory benchmarks:

Memory Read - 6709 MB/S
Memory Write - 2458 MB/S
Memory Latency - 43.7 ns

Super Pi 1MB - 32 secs

[Rob Williams]

Ugh, if you had a Venice 3200+ before, you shouldn't have upgraded anything personally, beacuse imo it can't really be considered an upgrade when you look at the overclocking possibilities.

At any rate, things are looking good so far. What is your VDIMM at? If it's not as high as 3.0, try that and then 1:1 at 250FSB.

[dborgill]

Hmmm.. my VDIMM is at the highest setting in the BIOS... +0.2 V? Doesn't that equal 2.7?

I am a little confused though because I tried using a memory divider (166mhz) and lowering the HTT to 3x but it didn't change my CPU speed settings at all.

By the way, I am doing this all in Windows via ClockGen because I can't get ANY good results overclocking direct from the BIOS.

EDIT: I cranked my vcore voltage up in the BIOS and I can get 2772 mhz and lowered super pi to 30 seconds. I don't know what else to do. Do you think it is the memory holding me back or is a 572 mhz overclock ok for my hardware?

[Rob Williams]

Jesus, I'd be happy with 2.77GHz. Chances are that could be the max you will crank out of that chip, but chances are greater you could go even higher with your Venice. So, if that's a stable OC, then you are fine and dandy.

What are your new Sandra/EVEREST scores? If an OC is possible with ClockGen, then it would be possible with your BIOS, because it essentially does the same thing.

Personally, I'd try to hit 2.8GHz since you are so close. What divider are you using?

[dborgill]

Everest @ 2772 mhz (No divider man, it's running 1:1 !)

Memory Read: 6900 MB/s
Memory Write: 2535 MB/s
Memory Latency: 42.6

Hmmmm... I am pretty happy with this overclock. I have no idea if the Opty would go higher or the Venice. Although, I have more cache with the Opty or San Diego....

EDIT: Looks like I am about 27 C IDLE and 42 C full load running maximum heat on Prime95. Not too shabby for a pretty inexpensive heatsink/fan!!

[Rob Williams]

**** extra cache, that's all I can say. It certainly doesn't justify your $150 purchase. I'd try the Venice again and see if you have better luck overclocking. Those are rather low EVEREST scores for that speed.. I had nearer 31 latency and over 7,500MB/s read at those rates.

[dborgill]

**** extra cache, that's all I can say. It certainly doesn't justify your $150 purchase. I'd try the Venice again and see if you have better luck overclocking. Those are rather low EVEREST scores for that speed.. I had nearer 31 latency and over 7,500MB/s read at those rates.


LOL! Hey man, you are the expert. I will throw in the 3200+ and see what I can get with that new memory just in case.

About the $$$, I got the upgrades for "free".. I just do side jobs for my friend and he takes my old hardware for credit. I didn't pay a cent..

He said he could try to get me an Opty next week.. dunno what I should stick with. Or... try to get that G-Skill mem. :confused:

EDIT: I forgot to ask. Why if I am lowering my HTT and using a memory divider, it doesn't change my clock speeds at all?

[Rob Williams]

Ahh ok, free is no problem then : o)

If possible you could get the Optie, you may just want to get that and then sell the two CPU's you have. The Opti will no doubt overclock past 3.0GHz with good cooling, and then in the future you could try getting the G. Skill after you get the cash or do the jobs for your friend.

If you lower your HTT and keep the Divider the same, it should certainly lower your clock speed o.O

[dborgill]

Yeah, it's a nice little hookup.

I will try to swing the Optie, who knows... I'll keep ya posted.

Yeah, I go into the BIOS and I have tried HTT 4x and 3x and when I check my clock speeds they are exactly the same as if I hadn't done anything. Very stange...

Just noticed your gamertag -- I'll have to add you to the friends list. You ever play any multiplayer?

[Rob Williams]

Oh, that HTT. I really have no bloody clue what that even does, so I'd leave it default, lol. I meant HTT as in FSB.

Yup, I play a little bit of online. What games do you play?

[dborgill]

LOL --- I thought that HTT was the multiplayer for the FSB. Like you could do a 166mhz memory divider and a 3x HTT divider.

I play Perfect Dark Zero and Call of Duty 2 mostly.. but I am addicted to Everquest II right now

[Rob Williams]

The only things I deal with while overclocking usually are the FSB, Multiplier and Divider. I really never toyed with the HTT multi before, but I believe mine goes up to 5x.

I have only played PDZ online once and I suck at console FPS, so I quit that one. I don't have CoD2 either. I played DoA4 online the other day and had my ass handed to me. I'm not meant to play online ;)

[dborgill]

Oh ok. Yeah, I think it is my memory holding me from going any further. I have read a lot of 3700+ reviews and other Gigabyte board forums and everyone says that TCCD RAM (Especially A.DATA and G-Skill brands) works best in our boards. Most are reporting 280-320 FSB when using that RAM...

Anyway, yeah, since this stupid Everquest II addiction started, my 360 has kinda been collecting dust.. although I just went to a friends house at lunch and played Marble Blast Multiplayer. It rocked.

[madmat]

That HTT keeps the bus speed at 1000 or there abouts. Setting it to 5 with a FSB of 200 = 1000, at 4 with a FSB of 250 = 1000 and so on.

It's there to keep the HTT from becoming unstable and hosing your OC.

[dborgill]

That HTT keeps the bus speed at 1000 or there abouts. Setting it to 5 with a FSB of 200 = 1000, at 4 with a FSB of 250 = 1000 and so on.

It's there to keep the HTT from becoming unstable and hosing your OC.


That is right but shouldn't I be able to set my HTT to 4 @ 200 FSB and it equals = 800? So using that combined with a memory divider, I thought you could normally overclock higher...

[Jakal]

Some have had issues keeping the htt at 5x200 or 1000mhz. It's been suggested numerous times to reduce to 4x if you're going for a very large overclock. You'll make up for it when upping the fsb. Right now mine is at 4x and 900mhz. Since I'll be pushing it further to a 4x250 it'll make up the difference.

[DarkSynergy]

I say, just as everyone else has, go with the Opteron.

http://aqm4.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=553


Thats what one can do with an Opteron. Just look at those scores. Never mind the cooling, you can do 3.0 GHz on air easily baby!

[dborgill]

I say, just as everyone else has, go with the Opteron.

http://aqm4.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=553


Thats what one can do with an Opteron. Just look at those scores. Never mind the cooling, you can do 3.0 GHz on air easily baby!


Sweeeeet! I will have him order that for sure. Now, since I will be using the same DDR500 RAM, I will probably have to use a mem divider on the Opty to get those high of scores right?

[Jacksn]

I would have to truthfully say that, this ASrock & Opteron combo has been "THE" number one upgrade for me in my 23+ years of the computer world. I am hitting 3Ghz stable with this chipset @ 1.45v on the CPU core with the AMD stock HSF. Never above 48c @ LOAD. There is also a vmod to reach 1.55v which I have not done yet. I imagine 3.2Ghz is not out of the realm with a good cooler like the "ArcticFreezer 64" at those volts. I can say I would highly recommend this motherboard & CPU combo to anyone with an AMD64 upgrade in mind.

[CoolZone]

go for the Opteron 148 all the way!

[Uc-ker]

Why the Opteron 148?

[humanzoo]

Why the Opteron 148?

I was wondering the same thing. Any socket 939 AMD should work as fine if not better then an Opteron 148. Aren't the Opteron 148 a higher NM chip, so they would get hotter then the more modern day socket 939 AMDs?

[Jakal]

Opty 146 max of 10x multiplier
148 max of 11x
150 max of 12x etc etc
Many are using the 146 and 148 simply because of the multiplier. You put a 10x with a 300mhz fsb and get 300x10=3.0Ghz. It's easy to count and many just want to hit that magic 3G spot. I know I do. If you can keep it cool enough a 148 or 150 are great too. You can reach 3+Ghz with a lower fsb.

I just need to hit a fsb of 250 to reach 3ghz (12x250) while, like jacksn posted, is using a 11x and 274 fsb. My processor has never gone above 40 with my Zalman 9500. All I'm waiting on is some better ram to push it to 3Ghz+.

You can't always rely on fsb either. Some processors just can't reach that high. If you look around at the steppings and serials you'll find that a lot of Opteron's don't reach massive Ghz, and those that do are using peltier, water cooling, or even phase change.

I'm going to suggest just looking around and keeping your eyes open. Ebay has a lot of 146 and 148's for sale for great prices. Take a look at some oc'ing results too, and which cores and steppings reached it. You're more likely to have better results from similar models.

[izzie]

Don't the newer AMDs overclock further and generate less heat?

[Jakal]

Yep! :D:D:D