Time for a new one!

[Jakal]

Ok I've managed to hold down a decent job and am able now to build a complete system. So here's what I've got planned. Any suggestions?

Case: <a href ="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811133154">Thermaltake Armor</a> ~$150
Power Supply: <a href ="http://www.directron.com/ult31851.html>Ultra X2 550W</a> ~$100
Motherboard: <a href ="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813136166">DFI LanParty UT NF4 Sli-Dr Expert</a> ~$200
Processor: <a href ="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103594">Opteron 150</a> ~$330
Heatsink: <a href ="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835118223">Zalman 9500</a> ~$60
Ram: G.Skill / Corsair 2g kit Pc4000
Hard Drive: Western Digital 200G Sata-2
Video Card: <a href ="http://www.clubit.com/product_detail.cfm?itemno=A9602790">eVga 7800GT</a> ~$300

That list runs about 1300 on NewEgg, but I've found a couple other places that have some better prices.
I'd like to get 3Ghz out of the processor, a 250x12 fsb & multi should be alright. The Pqi ram has tighter timings than the other two, and newegg has a better price on them as well. I've already got a keyboard, mouse, etc, etc..
I'd like to keep the price down as much as I can. I don't want to buy cheap parts, but I'm not planning on spending a fortune on this thing.

I do have a few questions though.

1. Would 3Ghz be possible on air cooling?
2. Is the 7800GTX really worth it, or can I unlock the other 4 pipelines?
3. Which ram would be better?

I'm not trying to build an UBER 1337 HAXXORZ pc. I'd just like something I won't have to mess with for at least 2 or 3 years. I'm doing less and less gaming due to work and school but I still would like to pick up CoD2 and BF2. If any of you know of a better option let me know I'd be glad to hear it.

[Rob Williams]

Matt's the PSU guy, so I'll leave that to him. I would *highly* recommend you get a 2GB kit though, 1GB is on the way out, especially if you want BF2.

I can see 3GHz being quite achievable on that CPU, especially with a nice cooler. I would personally go with the 7800GT over the GTX unless the price is too good to beat. Generally, you will not likely notice it unless you are running new games at above 1280*1024 resolution.

Corsair Platinum PC4000 2GB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145596)
eVGA 7800GT w/ Free Quake IV (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814130247)

Those are my two recommendations. I am not too sure about the PSU, but the rest makes a great PC.

[madmat]

I'd suggest something a bit better than the Just PC as it's a "mystery meat" type PSU, you just don't know what you're getting with it.

My suggestion would be the Antec NeoHE 550, That's a very, very demanding motherboard and it's not in the least forgiving of weak 12V lines especially coupled with a pair of 7800GTX cards in SLI.

By the choice of the mobo I'm assuming that you intend to go SLI in the future...

[Jakal]

Well I did look up some reviews of the Just Pc power supply before choosing it. It's not a name brand power supply per se but it's performance is quite adequate. I do plan on going with an Sli setup sometime in the future.
I ran across a review of http://www.amdboard.com/sansun_arctic_550w.htm. I'm thinking maybe that would be the better buy in this situation. All of the reviews on NewEgg say that the Antec will NOT work with almost any current Asus board.

Edit: Am I doing something wrong or is the href coding just not enabled for my account?

<a href="http://www.amdboard.com/sansun_arctic_550w.html">Sansun Arctic 550w</a>

[madmat]

The NeoHE is the exception, trust me on this...it has three 12V rails and has no issues with that motherboard at all.

The True II 550's only have two 12V rails and aren't up to the task although they're both certified by nV for SLI.

This should tell you something, if a known quality builder is having trouble with this particular board then it's quite likely that the lesser knowns will have them as well...

You'd be foolish to go with less than the NeoHE or PC Power & Cooling 510SLI with that board. That's just the facts as they stand.

[Rob Williams]

I also highly recommend getting a good PSU. When it comes to your expensive hardware, especially the ones that really push the power, it's important.

[madmat]

Here's a good choice for you, it's cheaper than the NeoHE and has more than enough power for your system... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817711002 and this is by ASUS... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817712003

[Jakal]

Multiple postings from NewEgg:
DO NOT...I REPEAT DO NOT GET IF YOU HAVE ASUS A8N32-SLI DELUXE motherboard.

Incompatible with Asus A8N32-SLI DELUXE motherboard.

There were a whole bunch more and it seems they all are about the A8N line by Asus.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/CustRatingReview.asp?DEPA=0&Type=&Item=N82E16817103941&SortField=0&Pagesize=100&Page=

As well as this from the site itself: http://www.antec.com/us/support_roductInfo_FAQ.php?Qnumber=1&FAQno=22

Now it may just be a bios revision that would have to be done, but I don't want to get caught in the middle of a bios update and lose power. I certainly don't have the money to buy 2 high end power supplies.

Reading more reviews it seems this motherboard is at home with any top name power supply. Going to Nvidia's site also led me to look into an Ultra X2 550w Power supply. But that's not the main thing I've decided. I think I'm just going to get the Dfi Ultra Nf4 board. The gaming results are really too close for a sure winner and it definitely overclocks better. Opteron processors aren't mentioned as a supported cpu there's plenty of people out there using them. I doubt I'll ever need the Dual 16x sli option and the Dfi was my second choice.

[madmat]

The DFI likely has better memory performance as well...the x16 chipset just doesn't have a viable need at the present time really. Bear in mind though that you'll still need a good PSU no matter what brand mobo you get and the Ultra will require a small mod to run in SLI mode although you can find guides online for this.

I don't know if the X-2 is readily available yet though since it's brand new but hopefully you'll be able to find it, that's a nice looking PSU (ratings and features along with looks) and should be very good for you.

[Jakal]

https://secure.newegg.com/NewVersion/WishList/WishDetail.asp?position=HISTORY&ID=1848027&WishListTitle=Opty+Build

There's the wishlist from NewEgg, they didn't have the X2 in stock so I put one with a similar price. With shipping all from NE it's looking like 1500, which isn't too bad. I've found most of the parts cheaper looking through bizrate. I figure I can get away with spending 1200 total. I even found that power supply for under 90. I'll be getting my tax returns within the next month, but I'm going to start ordering the pieces in the next week or two. Hell, I'll even buy that digital camera I've been wanting.

[madmat]

Your wish list Detail is empty.


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Your "Current Wish List" will be deleted after 30 days, so make sure to save your wish list. Please note that adding an item to a wish list does not guarantee availability or price.

Sorry man but a newegg wishlist requires your browser to be cookied for them to recognize it as belonging there...

What PSU are you getting, please don't skimp there...

[Jakal]

I ordered the Ultra X2 off of Directron.com. It ended up being about a hundred with shipping. Sorry about the wishlist thing. I did save it and listed it as shared, can't imagine why it's not working :rolleyes: . I'll be ordering the Dfi Expert this evening along with the case.

I still have some questions about the ram though. I know 2 gigs is needed for most of the high end games, but brand wise. I'm still up in the air on which kit to get. I don't want whole 1g sticks. The Dfi seems to be a little picky when it comes to ram, I'm thinking of going with the Crucial Ballistix kit. Those of you who can recommend a good kit without blowing my budget I'd be much abliged.

I'm going to just update my first post with the current info on the build. What products I've bought, etc. I'm definitely looking forward to a new pc!

[madmat]

You're better off running a 2x1gig kit, the GSkill that I recommended to Madstork is really good and is compatible with the DFI boards, plus it's $60 cheaper than the Corsair kit.

the reason I say to go with 2X1 rather than 4X512 is that your board will only run 4 sticks at 2T command rate which is considerably slower and going with fast ram for OC headroom usually means higher latencies to begin with, coupling that with 2T command rates will really hobble your memory bandwidth.

Nice choice on the PSU, I'm sure you'll love it. Same goes for the board, the Expert looks to be pretty damned pimp.

[madmat]

Here's a link to the ram. http://www.newegg.com/Product/CustRatingReview.asp?Item=N82E16820231021

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820231021

[Jakal]

I've looked into both of those options, I wasn't planning on spending so much on ram when I started, but I also just planned on buying a single gig kit. When the parts start to come in I'll use my Patriot ram until I can save up enough for a better set.

I've run across an offer from Club-It, where you can get an Evga 7800 GTX (eVGA N527-AX) for $450, with a $40 dollar mail in rebate. That's only about ten dollars more than the GT after rebate. I may go for that.

It may sound like I want to go hardcore with this pc, but I really just want to not have to worry about being oudated for the next few years. I don't want to have to upgrade everytime a new game comes out. To me, spending more than a thousand on a computer is really extreme. I also know that what I'm building couldn't be bought for less than two grand. The pc I'm using now I only spent $600 on. There's a lot of hard, frustrating work I've gone through to save up what I have. I mean, I could be putting a down payment on a newer car.. lol.

[madmat]

I spent $3500 on the PC I'm using now and other than swapping out ram for a dog set I got at the time (late 2003) and getting the 6800 in exchange for my 5900U when it suddenly freaked out it's basically the same PC as it was then.

Point being is I've been gaming on this PC for 2.5 years with no problems, yeah the newer games require a bit of sacraficing on resolution or IQ but that's curable with a CPU/GPU upgrade, I just don't have the cash for it.

When I can afford it though I intend to get a 3.0C or E to shoot for 4ghz with and hopefully by that time the 7800GS AGP will be out and I'll be in the game yet again. :)

I think the PC you're building will be the same way, another GTX in the future, 2 gigs of fast ram and a good OC and that PC will be potent for quite some time.

[Jakal]

Point being is I've been gaming on this PC for 2.5 years with no problems

That's the same with this one. I built this pc my Senior year in high school, 2003, and have been using it since. I've added the 9200 video card, a dvd rw, and just recently the 1 gig set of Patriot ram. It's served me well, but it's definitely time to upgrade.

[madstork91]

Id have to recomend the G.skill i got. Ill let mat sing the praises on it.

The pc4000 2 gig pack on newegg

[Jakal]

Stork, I'd be willing to buy a 2gig set off of you if you feel you didn't want or need it. I know you said it was too much of a hassle to send it back.

I'm kinda worried now about ordering the processor. I know the Opteron's can do 3Ghz but I'm not guaranteed a CABGE or CABYE that tend to oc better. I missed out on a CABGE on ebay, now I'm a little uncertain about purchasing one. Even if I do get a good core, would air cooling be enough to reach the 3g mark.. I've seen the 148's with a CABYE reach 3g on air I'm quite sure it's possible with the 150; I just need to find a good core. The 150 is about $350 with some Arctic Silver 5. I'd sure like to know ahead of time which core I'm getting!

[madmat]

If you'll watch certain sites will list the stepping of the procs they're selling. I don't remember which they were but you'll also end up paying a premium for them which in my book isn't worth it.

I say just take your chances and go for it with newegg, I haven't heard of any other opty steppings BUT those 2 so you knever know...you most likely will get one.

[Jakal]

Recorded AMD 64 Cores (http://www.ocforums.com/showpost.php?p=2748997&postcount=6)

I found a pulled cpu on ebay with the CAABC revision. You're right though, it seems the better cores have come out more recently. I just ordered the Opty 150 retail the Zalman and a tube of Arctic Silver 5.

[madmat]

Nice! I can't wait to see what your rig does!

[Jakal]

I'm going to have to wait until Friday to order the video card. My bank has a $1000 spending limit on my debit card, and I need to put some more money in. I'm not near running out and I could order the rest tomorrow, but I also need to leave some, just in case. It looks like my tax returns will probably cover half the build. Katrina really messed me up with work, and home and everything else lol.

[madmat]

The GTX or the GT? I'm kind of lost on this one...

[Jakal]

I'm going to order the GTX from ClubIt. I found the $40 dollar discount through Pricegrabber which puts the GTX roughly 10-15 more than the GT. I'm willing to pay that much more.

[madmat]

Nice, good deal then, that's definitely worth $10 to $15!

[Bobbythecat]

Hmm..I thought Opterons require registered mem..? Perhaps I am ignorant, but I am also wondering whether the DFI board can handle the server CPU...even if the socket matches.

[Jakal]

Yes and no. The Opteron 1XX line does NOT require ecc registered memory, where as, the 2XX and 8XX line DO. The Opteron should feel right at home in the Dfi board. The Opty 150 is a single core processor, running a 90nm process, with an E4 stepping. The Dfi goes up to E6, I believe, with the latest bios supporting the FX-60's.

AMD socket939 Athlon FX55+ & Athlon X2 CPU supported
I was concerned with the Dfi not supporting the Opteron processor myself, until I read this from AnandTech (http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.aspx?catid=28&threadid=1732211&frmKeyword=&STARTPAGE=2&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear).
I should be looking at close to, if not, 3Ghz with the Zalman. I'll possibly add a water cooling system later on. Looking at some of those scores, I wondered if I should have went with the Opty 165 or 170. Then I realized that I'll be able to run any game out there with no problem.

ALSO:
The case and power supply came in today:D :D !! I was so stoked when I drove in! That case is a monster though. I didn't realize how big it was! Someone should put an object in these pictures just for size reference. The case was wonderfully packed and pristine when I took it out. The Ultra X2 power supply came in too, and let me tell you, ITS A BEAUT! Silver finish on it with a black grill. It's going to look perfect in that case . Tomorrow I'll be getting in the motherboard, processor, and heatsink. I need to get that camera so I can keep you guys filled in!

[Jakal]

NewEgg delivers AGAIN! Received in my Opty 150 today, CABGE :D 0532MPMW stepping. These aren't the best overclockers but I've seen a couple get to 3Ghz. Looking around I found that a lot of people are using the XP-90 as their heatsink for overclocking, we'll have to see how the Zalman turns out. I'm two pieces away from complete rig.

Which brings me to another thing.. I'm going to have to replace the windshield in my car shortly.. :mad: We've had some freezing temps lately and Wednesday driving to work I saw part of my windshield cracking. The laws here in Florida won't let me drive around with a cracked windsheild so I'm going to HAVE to replace it. Looks as though I'm going to have to put off buying the rest until another two weeks.:(

I screwed up the prices on the GTX, it's a hundred more than the GT. $450, instead of $290. I got to looking and totally forgot how much the GT was. Still, depending on what happens in the near future, I may get it instead. I'd kill for a regular pci video card right now just to see this rig run.

[Jakal]

Spent all of yesterday evening running the wires for the case. I think it's going to turn out well. I'm thinking of getting a blacklight for the case to show off the uv reactive wires and board. :rolleyes: I turned it on just to get an idea of how loud the case was and I was very impressed. It's very quiet for the amount of fans. Of course the pc wouldn't boot, but it gave me an idea of how it runs. It's got a low hum, but compared to the pc I've got now, it's extremely quiet.

Edit:
Just ordered the video card. I picked up a 7800GT 517 core 470/1100 speeds. should be here Tuesday at the latest. Tack on another $300 for that. I'm just going to use my 80gig for testing to see if everything is ok. Pick up the sata hd and ram later on. I'm itching to see some results.

[madmat]

Sux about the windshield but if the crack's not too terribly long it can be fixed by drilling a small hole at the end of the crack with a diamond bit drill then using a windsield crack repair kit or taking it to a place that performs that service. We have those all over here since there is so much crap on the roads and so many trucks kicking it up...

[Jakal]

Well it's not one crack.. there's a few spider cracks and spread out about as large as an open hand in the left front corner. Right above the inspection sticker. I'm told that the insurance company will pay for it with no deductable because of that law. Hopefully so.

Edit: This report is the main reason I chose the Opteron 150.
<a href ="http://techreport.com/reviews/2004q2/opteron-x50/index.x?pg=1">TechReport</a>

[Jakal]

Spur of the moment buy.. I picked up a Arctic Cooler 5 rev 3 off ebay last night. Roughly 30 with shipping.

[Rob Williams]

So that I don't have to go through and pick and choose what you put together, could you list your system specs you are going with?

[Jakal]

No problem. I'll be upgrading the ram and hard drive later on.

Thermaltake Armor
Opteron 150 2.4G
Zalman 9500
Dfi Expert
7800GT
Arctic Silencer Rev. 3
Patriot pc3200 2x512
WD Caviar 80G Ata-100

I'll be picking up a 250g WD Sata hard drive with 16mb buffer, and a few weeks after that I'll probably get the G.Skill. Although, the new Mushkin Redline is looking rather tasty.

[Rob Williams]

Nice man, that's some wicked stuff. I look forward to seeing what you think of the 150 :-D

I'm also jealous of your DFI Expert board.. nice choice.

[Jakal]

Considering the Expert was only $20 more than the original, I couldn't see passing it up. Hoping to get some good results from the Opty.. Looking around today I found a 4200 X2 for almost the same price though. :shrug:
It'll be an excellent system either way.

[Jakal]

WHOO HOO! Just got the video card in! I'll be checking back in in about an hour with some results!

[madmat]

Yaaaay!!!111!!!oneoneone

[Jakal]

Well took more than an hour but the network took the longest to get right.

Problem, at least I think it is.
I've got the Zalman 9500 connected up to the fanmate thingy.. and when the pc boots up right after post the fan completely stops spinning. My guess is that it's because of temps being low. So I connected it up to the motherboard pins instead and set the speed/temps ratio for it to turn off below 25c and to turn fully on at 45c. So I'm watching this little light show from the fan... Could it have been doing the same thing because of the fanmate?

Edit: Memtest was A-OK with the patriot ram.

[madmat]

Great, yes the voltages are likely dropping far enough that with the fanmate it's giving you less than the 5 or 7V needed to run the fan.

Glad to hear that the ram's doing good for you.

[Jakal]

Well I feel better now, but there's something else. I don't know if it's the nforce hardware or windows or what.. My bandwidth seems to be cut to less than a third of what it used to be. Before, when I'd go to the cnet bandwidth tester I'd get 2.2Mbps+. Now I'm getting ~600kbps, and I've seen it at ~150 since using this mb. I did have a network card instead of the onboard network (in my other pc), but there was little difference in the bandwidth. I've tried resetting the modem fully disconnecting and reconnecting it, unplugging it and restarting the pc then plugging it back in.. All sorts of stuff, did anyone else have this kind of problem? I'll get in touch with my cable provider in the morning, see what I can find out.

And another thing... Almost all of my downloads have been corrupted somehow. It took me 5 tries to get FireFox and windows update doesn't even connect. No I'm not trying to update using FF.

[madmat]

Disable the nVidia firewall...it's nice in concept but not so nice in use...

[Jakal]

Just did a full on reinstall and complete format. Internet worked just fine afterwards. Now back to reinstallations.

[madmat]

Oh joy...Kinda like wash, rinse, repeat isn't it?

[Jakal]

Lol yeah! I did get rid of the nvidia firewall thing though. Everytime I had a new program installed and after rebooting it gave me an error saying I needed to restart... AGAIN. So it's gone.

Heads up, don't use speedfan with nf4 boards!:mad: Caused my system to do an instant shut down. I had to turn the power supply off and then back on for it to post.

[madmat]

Email the author about it so he knows what to look for...

[Jakal]

I dropped him a line reporting the problem.

Got the processor running at 2.7G 12x225. Core is 1.37v haven't touched it, the ram I bumped from 2.66 to 2.68v. Been running folding@home for ~6 hours while I was at school. Temps were below 30c when I got in. I'll loosen up the timings on the ram, currently 2.5-3-3-6, and increase the core a little see where I can go. I've seen some PDP ram hit 40mhz oc.

[madmat]

Run 2 instances (each instance in it's own folder) of F@H to stress the CPU better since it is a dually. Go into task manager and set the affinity of each instance to one core or the other.

[Jakal]

The 150 isn't a dual core. The 165's and higher recieved dual cores. The ram doesn't like cas 3, but I got it to 2.5-3-3-8 @ 230mhz. Super Pi won't run, and I get errors in aq3. I haven't touched the chipset or core voltages yet, and the ram is running at less voltage now than it was before. I set it for 2.66 but I'm reading 2.62 through the smarguard program.

http://i1.tinypic.com/mljitz.jpg

[Jakal]

Stable as a rock at 225x12 2.7ghz. No voltage increases and stock timings. I'm just going to leave it there til I get the better ram.

[madmat]

Pretty nice man.

[Jakal]

The 7800 is running 490/1200 with stock sink. I should be getting the Arctic cooler tomorrow or saturday. Might be able to boost it to 500/1200, we'll see. I'll start up some benchmarks to see what'll happen. Didn't have any problems running f@h today so it should be alright.

[madmat]

Can't wait to see what happens!

[Jakal]

Haven't been able to do much testing due to work and school. I've been setting up updates and patches when I can. I ran Aq3 the first night at 2.56Ghz got about 90k and somewhere in the neighborhood of 8k in 3dmark05. That was before the format. I'll try to keep you guys updated but I'm in and out for the next few days. I just keep running f@h to check stability. So far so good.